110m hurdles winner and multiple medalist of the world championships in the 110m hurdles Sergei Shubenkov took only third place in the Finals of the track and field athletics series «Queen of Russian Sports» in Yekaterinburg, after which he described the completed competitive period as a «shit season». The next day, the Sport correspondent began an interview with the athlete with this very topic, and as a result discussed the non-admission of Russians, the IOC, Ukraine, Elena Isinbayeva, the ill-fated motorcycle and much more.
— Sergey, how mood?
— Not really, to be honest. Sad. Didn't expect such an outcome. I thought it would be possible to end the season on a positive note. But it didn't happen. I'm looking for an explanation of what went wrong, but so far it's hard to find one. At the Russian Championships in Chelyabinsk, everything was very good, as far as possible. Here everything promised to be better, but did not grow together at all.- There was an aura of invincible Shubenkov — you have not lost in domestic competitions for ten years. Now there is no halo — the second in the championship of Russia, the third in the Final of the «Queen of Sports». Everyone who is in the subject understands that a fracture of the collarbone, recovery, have not taken shape. But there is a saying: «The game will be forgotten, the result will remain.» Maybe it was worth not to force the exit to the competition and recover normally? The winning streak could continue.No, I don't regret anything at all. It is right that we went and participated in these competitions. Yes, one story ended, but it was preceded by another — the same, cool one, where I am the world champion, I have a lot of medals, I run under the European record. And no one will rewrite this story and take it away. Yes, I thought that I would overcome certain circumstances, but I did not. What will happen next — we'll see. I don't think next year will be like this one.
— You described the season after the final start as «shitty». And if you look at what happened before the injury, it’s really not your seconds there either. What is missing — are you delving into yourself, looking for?
— Yes, something is missing, I'm digging. I don’t even know how to answer, because there is no one reason that would lie on the surface. in order. The first thing might be that you are no longer 25 years old, but 32. Direct question — is age an obstacle to running for a result of 13 seconds, plus or minus hundredths?
Age is a factor to be taken into account. And the approach to training should be changed accordingly. But age is not a barrier. I feel the strength to run fast.
— What's wrong with training? Only here it is necessary to explain it in an interesting way, otherwise it is believed that the topic of training cannot arouse the interest of readers.
— There is no point in arguing, there is no hype in training, which is why I have not been on social networks for months. The daily routine—getting up, brushing your teeth, going to the gym, doing this and that—is of no interest to anyone. But competitions, travel is another thing. Even in Novosibirsk, getting stuck in a traffic jam is an event for me, because of this I later flew to the Russian Championship. And for a huge number of Novosibirsk — a routine.To begin with, I have chronic sores that behave unpredictably. In some year, everything is fine, in some — Achilles is torn. The next year, another Achilles hurts but does not tear. This year, if it ached somewhere, then within the limits of the permissible and controlled, although in the spring they were treated pretty well. But, for example, my «strengths» and pharmacology gave me a noticeable weight gain.
Yes, of course. Everyone understands that there is no professional training without pharmacology, but in no case do I use prohibited substances in any form. Whether I gained too much weight, I don't know. The coach says it's too much. But then he got injured, and after it his legs stopped hurting, and the weight went away. But the result did not come.- It is believed that experienced coaches know a clear path — what to do for the athlete's championship. You have walked this path many times. Why change something in training, if you already know how it is done?
— But this does not work. If you do the same thing for years, the body gets used to it. He needs shakes. You cannot do the same thing every year and achieve the same results. We need a surge, sometimes a shock.
— But the shock does not always work in the right direction.
— Not always. But that’s why I have a coach with my intuition, which is not very good. It is clear that there is a base and a scientific approach, but there is also a creative spark. who raised Olympic champions in figure skating: «Training hurts.» Maybe you are tired of enduring pain?
— No. I believe that there should be no pain during training. If it hurts, something must be done.
— But training is violence against the body.
— There can be no two opinions on this. It’s hard and unpleasant, but there shouldn’t be pain, I think so. I am trying to stick to this paradigm now.Let's move on to possible psychological reasons. When an athlete of your level has a clear goal — the Olympics, the World Championship — everything is obvious. You, like all Russian athletes, now have neither the Olympics nor the World Championship. Judging by the words of the President of the World Athletics Association Sebastian Coe, in the foreseeable future is not expected. I miss, of course, those times when all the doors were open. I hope that they will return and still have time to catch something. Maybe in some other form, not in the way it was before. BRICS games are being prepared for us, aren't they?
And the Friendship Games. And I remember «Friendship-84», although I was a child, it was interesting.
Yes, I hope that an alternative will appear and it will not be so boring. Although now I have driven myself into such a framework that I am not bored either at the Russian Championships or at the “Queen of Sports” Final. It was necessary to cut and fight, and not a fig not the first.
— That is, the lack of motivation affects.
— I'll jump to another topic, then I'll explain why. Will you follow the World Championships in Athletics in Budapest? >— And I came up with a motivation for you. There, someone will run for 12.95, you will see it, get angry — and go ahead, train with ten times the intensity. In order to overtake him at least in absentia. Can it work?
It didn't work in 2016, and even more so now. Yes, I really want to show beautiful seconds. But I understand what they are worth. Show them only for self-satisfaction? On the one hand, yes, I would like to, on the other hand, I have already satisfied myself in this regard. And I ran out of 13 seconds, and won a lot of things. I like to run, I love to compete. I understand that it is not necessary to compete, as in Yekaterinburg, it should not be like this. Therefore, it is necessary to find a balance so as not to destroy the body at all and it was not corny to be ashamed.
— To close the topic of the World Cup — why don't you want to watch? According to the logic that you somehow voiced — if you don’t want to see me, then I’m not interested either?
— Something like that. I work and work, there are no complaints against me, but at some point they said: «Sorry, we don't need you.» Why not needed, something wrong? «No, it's all right, but we don't need you.»- Since we've come up with this topic. I remember we discussed it last year, you then said that, perhaps, at that moment our presence at international competitions would be really undesirable.
— Yes, I had in mind scandals like the one that was recently in fencing with Ukrainian and Russian athletes. Only then it would be much more, and everything would be sharper. Now it seems to have calmed down.
— Do you think? But Russian tennis players in certain countries are not allowed to cross the border. In the situation with the Russian fencer who extended her hand and did not wait for an answer, the international federation makes a decision that does not comply with the set of its own rules, and the Ukrainian parliament calls for her to be disqualified. Are you ready to compete now in international tournaments where there is such discrimination?
I don't think it would be massive. After all, there was a situation in 2014, but we went to tournaments. Although propaganda in different countries presented this situation in different ways. The maximum that was from foreign athletes was puzzled questions: «How do you, Russians and Ukrainians, generally communicate?» And we, two buddies, a Russian and a Ukrainian, lived in the same room, we discussed all these topics, in fact. Everything was in order, the guys were adequate. More precisely, they were adequate. Now I do not know. It must be understood that these cases of discrimination are isolated against the background of either indifference or ignorance of what is really happening. Although isolated cases of raspberries can be polluted so that everything around stinks.
— He won’t stretch out his hand, he won’t stand on a pedestal, he will turn his ass at the start. Anything can happen. I understand that no one needs scandals, they prefer to avoid them. But, honestly, in the West, athletes for the most part do not even know where Ukraine is located. Therefore, no provocations should be expected from them at all. And from the Ukrainians, unfortunately, yes. And, alas, two brainwashed boobies are enough to spoil the whole atmosphere of the holiday, mutual understanding, cultural exchange, which all these major competitions have always been. Propaganda works very well there.
—Maria Lasitskene talked about her Ukrainian friends who, after the start of the SVO, stopped communicating with her. Do you have examples in this area?
— There are none like Masha's. I don't interact much with my colleagues. There were friends. Probably, I can only remember Olga Saladukha. We talked, discussed all these topics, she adequately reacted to everything. We handed over things to her when Donetsk (the hometown of the athlete — ed.) began to be bombed in 2014. Five years have passed, a person becomes a deputy of the Rada and declares: «We do not want to compete with Russian athletes.» It is «we» who speaks for everyone.
«Isinbayeva is a sincere person, but she needs to think better»
—President of the Russian Olympic Committee Stanislav Pozdnyakov named the head of World Athletics Sebastian Coe is a Russophobe. Do you think something good will happen under Coe for Russian athletics?
— He started his policy, so it oppresses her, obviously. But on the other hand, it is clear that decisions are guided by different interests. And not only their own. And the wind can blow in the other direction at any moment. And he will have to adapt to it. Maybe he will turn politics. But it needs reasons.
— It seemed to me that Coe's motive was some kind of stubborn, purely British, dislike of Russia.
— It is, I would say, very fundamental and systemic.
— In terms of athletics, who can Russia interfere with on the world stage now? Let's be honest: a maximum of five Russian athletes globally claim something in the world. It would be possible to let go of this whole situation and let them compete.
— Even if not five, but ten, it certainly is. But the reason is not athletics. And the consequences are also not athletics. I believe things can change, but it won't be because Coe's mood just changes.
— There are current recommendations of the IOC, most federations are still implementing them to one degree or another. Athletics is one of the few sports already where Russians are not allowed to enter the international arena categorically and in any status. The IOC can't do anything about it.
“And it's amazing to me. The IOC, it would seem, is an authoritative structure, but as soon as a split arose within, there was no consolidating force. After all, our international federations are all monolithic and solid. In the same World Athletics, Coe was re-elected twice on a non-alternative basis, despite the fact that they play democracy there and there are a lot of collegiate bodies — congress, council, commissions, like in other federations. And the IOC, as it turned out, in a situation where a conflict broke out inside, took an extremely vague position — neither ours nor yours, plus it postpones key decisions as much as possible. International federations look at this and begin to express their opinion. They refuse to comply with the recommendations of the IOC, although it always seemed to me that international sports stand on the same principles. And recommendations for federations were stronger than any laws and orders. However, it turned out that this is not the case, they can be omitted, and you will not get anything for it.
— There are two Russian representatives in the IOC — Shamil Tarpishchev and Elena Isinbayeva. A scandal has flared up around the statement of the two-time Olympic champion in recent months. Maybe all this was done on purpose so that Isinbayeva's work in the IOC would benefit Russia and help return our athletes to the international arena? Do you allow this option?
— I don’t know the specifics of this work, I don’t know how people get into the IOC and what they do there. When I talked with Lena a few years ago and asked what her work there was, she showed me the newsletter, which comes by e-mail exclusively for IOC members, and told me what issues she personally tried to raise at meetings. As far as I understand, there is the IOC executive committee that makes decisions, and there is the IOC as one big deliberative body. I do not think that one or two people can change the situation there. The strength is the international federations, which, so to speak, «sawing content».
— But the IOC has, for example, such leverage on international federations — to take away the right to host Olympic competitions. It was applied to boxing. However, for other reasons. For discrimination in the form of non-admission of Russians and Belarusians, they could apply to World Athletics.
— World Athletics for the IOC is the top 1 in terms of income, most broadcasts are sold from the Olympics in athletics. I think that the IOC can do nothing against World Athletics, except to give recommendations that the federation does not follow. A prime example was in 2016. The IOC then shifted the responsibility for the performance of the Russians at the Olympics in Rio to the international federations. Everyone made decisions of varying degrees of rigidity, but not a single one acted as tough as the athletics (only Daria Klishina was admitted to the competition from the Russians — ed.). I think next year, regarding the Olympics in Paris, everything will be about the same. Each federation will make its own decision, all leverage in the hands of Coe. I do not think that the IOC will take something away from World Athletics.
— Returning to Isinbayeva. It turns out that you are not a supporter of the version that she made a statement in order to continue working in the IOC and benefit the country?
— I am a supporter of the version that she made her statement in order to continue working in the IOC and benefit herself.
— But the IOC made her statement that she had a formal relation to the army, accepted and allowed to continue working. Maybe this will set a precedent for CSKA athletes — you, Maria Lasitskene, many others — to be allowed to compete?
— If so, good. But Lena hardly thought about it when she posted the publication.
— Surprised by what she said?
— Not surprised at all. I will say this: Lena is an absolutely sincere person, but she needs to be careful and think better before she says something. — not an obstacle, the legs will fall off — you have to finish»
— Returning to the ill-fated motorcycle that ruined the end of the season for you. What struck me the most in this situation was the sharp reaction of the coach, who accused you of irresponsible and thoughtless behavior. But you didn’t seem to have jumped with a parachute, cutting off the lines in advance. What is thoughtlessness?
— From this hobby of mine, of course, there was a benefit. Unloading your head and putting your thoughts in order helped a lot. I like active sports very much. But riding the same snowboard, I understand that the problem is not that I will fall and break my arm, which, by the way, has already happened to me. It's just another workout. It is impossible to snowboard without physical activity, even if it is small. On a motorcycle — and I rode an «endurik» — you still can’t ride in a relaxed state. You have to move your arms, and legs, and twist your ass, and strain your back. And this is also an additional training.
— So it's good.
— This is good for those whose main profession is not related to physical activity. And I can do such an additional workout only at a time when there are no main workouts. At a time when I need to rest to recuperate. And instead of resting, I go to one more actual workout, which I can’t do, this was my unprofessionalism.
— Did you understand that?
— Yes, I was looking for formats to strain as little as possible when skating, but at the same time rest my head as much as possible. I thought that I had found such a format — I made myself a route through a beautiful forest, once a week, for a maximum of 40 minutes. But as soon as I decided to see what happened around that turn, where I had not yet gone, this happened. A log and a broken collarbone.
— But still, the coach gave you a very hard hit.
— I deserve this. Accepted the accusations. Tried to get out of this situation. My repentance was active — I overcame some consequences for the Russian championship.“During the season, I definitely won’t do it again. In the off-season, maybe I'll do it like the Olympic pole vault champion Renault Lavillenie, who rides sportbikes on race tracks. But for now, I’ll take a break with this for several years.
— Adrenaline from sports, as former athletes say, is almost impossible to replace.
— This is true. I even miss this adrenaline in the off-season, while preparations are underway from August to May.
— You have already said that the plans are for a season, then another season, then another season. But someday these seasons will end. Any ideas what to do next? To compensate for the same lack of adrenaline.
— Yes. But for now, just ideas. I try to think about it as little as possible. Yes, I understand — it would probably be good to work out some plans, prepare in advance. But I'm not looking for a job yet.
— Are you sure that when the moment comes, you will find it?
“I won’t die of hunger, I’m sure of that. For a while (laughs). And I'm not sure of anything anymore. Somehow they called me from the bank, they offered to make a deposit for five years, a new product. I was horrified — what does it mean for five years? I can plan for a year. Three is the maximum where the horizon is still visible. And for five… I had a top year in 2018, when I won everything, went everywhere, ran 12.90 with a penny. Five years pass — I lose the championship of Russia. How could I have guessed this? Like the fact that the country will be fighting, that it will cost half a million to fly to Turkey on vacation with the whole family, that I won’t be able to order anything abroad? In 2018, I bought board games on the Internet that were not translated into Russian, looked for them on the forums, they were delivered to me, we played them with the company. And now I can buy something abroad with delivery without perversions?
— When a banned drug was found in your sample, many people registered you as dopingists. And Maria Lasitskene then said something like this: “I don’t want the story of the athlete Shubenkov to end that way.” Her wish came true. You proved your innocence, you were acquitted. Now, having watched two tournaments where you lost, I also say: I don’t want the story of the unique athlete Shubenkov, a nugget, a champion, to end like this. And how do you want the story of the athlete Shubenkov to end?
— I want to win everything and leave at the peak. I will do everything for this. As you can see, hands fall off — in general, this is a factor, but not an obstacle (laughs). But if the legs fall off, then you have to finish.